I have a buyer that wants me to put in a new panel because it might be. (Zinsco electrical panel photo below), 3. In older homes, there are still some electrical panel brands that have been commonly known to fail at safety standards. Production was halted when design flaws were discovered. Zinsco or Zinsco-Sylvania is the name given to a brand of electrical panel that was commonly installed up to the mid-1970's. It was a very popular product and installed throughout North America. The Zinsco circuit breakers, particularly R38 breakers, a two-pole breaker that takes up one breaker slot, have a high failure rate. The average cost of replacing a Zinsco service panel is $1,600 to $4,000. Will snapmore pix when I can drag myself away from computer. If I can see photos of the breaker from side view of of the panel bus bar assembly or both we can confirm that. Electrical panel interior access should be by a licensed and trained electrician. I should also point out that the 200 ampere mains are mounted differently and as far as I am aware had no problems like this. The first Zinsco panels and breakers- labeled "Magnatrip"- (patent issued in 1950) had copper bus-bars and breaker clips. I am always very careful what I say as many people quickly jump to conclusions that I am upselling or Fear marketing. I'm sorry to say that I have not found a credible Zinsco electrical panel age decoder. 2. Contact us if you have photos of a Frank Adams electrical panel or other details. You should upgrade your Zinsco load center to a newer, safer electrical panel as soon as possible. The copper shortage of the 1960's was primarily caused by the US . Completely by coincidence I happen to have gotten my hands on a Mr. Electric electrician today. IDENTIFY GTE SYLVANIA-ZINSCO PANELS at InspectApedia.com - online encyclopedia of building & environmental inspection, testing, diagnosis, repair, & problem prevention advice. And I would give strong consideration to replacing any panel that had. Your Wenatchee and Chelan Professional Real Estate, Home and Structural Pest Inspection Service. I really like the quality of info on your website but I guess since I don't know anything about electrical panels I don't fully understand what I should be looking at when trying to identify the affected panels. Often you will see evidence of arcing or burning at this location. panel or performs further disassembly (DANGEROUS STEP) can further identify the characteristic circuit breaker details but the circuit breaker I am wondering if you might take a quick glance and my photos and see if you think the same. Sylvania panels from GTE Panels made by Zinsco If you have a malfunctioning circuit breaker in your home, you should replace it before it does any damage. As a consequence of this, in Ontario we had to mount drywall behind panels for years. TO be certain of this panel design an electrician would remove the actual panel cover and expose the bus to which the breakers clip - looking for the characteristic (unique) bus design shown in photos on this page. In 1973, GTE-Sylvania (same owners of Zinsco) introduced their own panel and breaker design. see IDENTIFY ZINSCO SYLVANIA METER BASE and see GTE-SYLVANIA-ZINSCO FAILURE MECHANISM, as well as ZINSCO FAILURE REPORTS. Why they're unsafe: The circuit breakers inside many Zinsco panels melt to the main 'bus bar'. It showed that the central ZINSCO panel and circuit breaker failure problems stem from burn-ups at those clip-to-bus connections. Hi this seems to be a really helpful site, thanks! The inside box is a Zinsco/Sylvania model number 20-5x (7-14). Zinsco type Q, Qc, QCN, Q24, Cat. After hundreds of similar incidents, it was found that Zinsco panels were to blame for frequent electrical shocks, short circuits, and fires. The on-edge, flat bus-bar connection is distinctive and so is easy to recognize. Some other factors that will affect the price for replacing a Zinsco panel are: Depending on these and other factors, even newer wiring might need to be installed. This site includes photos of what happens if an electrical panel fails. I have personally experienced it over 20 times for overcurrent situations and about 5 times in fault current situations. On 2018-08-18 Zinsco breakers were frequently labeled with the name Zinsco Magnetrip breakers. - Vertical or "on edge" electrical panel bus bars identify a Zinsco design. If you're interested in more information or details please let me know. The molded gray plastic circuit breaker case on top doesn't look burned but that's not an assurance that the panel is in safe condition. Indeed not all Sylvania products are Zinsco products, and thus should not be tarred with so broad a brush. Proceed to complete the identification your panel by having its main bus design examined by your electrician. --- "Evaluating Wiring in Older Minnesota Homes," Agricultural Extension Service, University of Minnesota, St. Paul, Minnesota 55108. [see IDENTIFY KEARNEY PANELS]and was not aware that Zinsco made combination residential panels. He did not know about the Zinsco/Sylvania problem. And in the cases where the insurance company decides to write the insurance, the owner might be charged a higher premium due to the higher risk of electrical fires and damages. Watch out: the panel looks corroded, rusty, unreliable as a brand-independent hazard, and of course Zinsco breakers and panels are unsafe in any event. Below is a Zinsco HQGF20 GFCI circuit breaker with a black toggle switch. IDENTIFY ZINSCO ELECTRICAL PANELS at InspectApedia.com - online encyclopedia of building & environmental inspection, testing, diagnosis, repair, & problem prevention advice. On 2020-12-04 by (mod) One of my staff accidentally cut the wrong wire. the circuit breaker colors and other external details permit the inspector to identify the problem Zinsco-design electrical panel bus and circuit breaker materials. Thanks again *and* in advance after I get more pix! I'm looking for the AIC rating of the big double throw AC cutoff switch on the front. In addition, Zinsco panels typically have the logo at the top of the panel. Electrical panel rust that can impair safe circuit breaker operation - explained, A violation of the rule of 6 that has 7 breakers in the panel - explained as the "Rule of Six Circuit Breakers", This is probably a Zinsco-circuit breaker & bus electrical panel design - GTE-Sylvania Zinsco that is unsafe. Mr. Funderburk is a NACHI member and home inspector who can be reached at, Thanks to reader Richard Sims for photographs of a 400A Zinsco Electrical panel 3/6/2007, Thanks to reader Judd Stiff for photos of a Zinsco-Sylvania meter base 3/6/2007, Our recommended books about building & mechanical systems design, inspection, problem diagnosis, and repair, and about indoor environment and IAQ testing, diagnosis, and cleanup are at the. Zinsco panels were designed at the beginning of the 20th century, a time with no computers, TV sets, washing machines or many of the appliances that make our day-to-day life so much easier. I went to those sites and still cannot determine if mine is a Zinsco. Production of Zinsco panels halted in mid-1970s. Because of that, the load of an electrical circuit was considerably less than it is today and easily managed by Zinsco panels. It has Zinsco type rc38al circuit breaker in it. white stickers telling you not to remove those "knockout" pair of opening covers. Is replacing a Zinsco breaker panel worth it? It is a Zinsco type electrical panel and should be replaced. "Basic Housing Inspection," US DHEW, S352.75 U48, p.144, out of print, but is available in most state libraries. Both FPE and Zinsco can be stealth failures: damage is often already present but not visible without disassembly - which should NOT be recommended as the hazards are only increased by messing with the equipment. Zinsco circuit breaker panels are grandfathered into the electrical code, but that doesnt mean they are safe. We are pleased to credit and link-to contributors. "Simplified Electrical Wiring," Sears, Roebuck and Co., 15705 (F5428) Rev. ML12(12-24)C (Indoor) - Mod. I agree with that advice, but I acknowledge that the data base of tested Zinsco equipment confirming the failures is smaller than that of the FPE Stab-Lok hazard discussed elsewhere at InspectApedia. The amps rating of the panel box is often on a label on the inside of the cover or on occasion on the sidewall inside of the electrical box - something your electrician can find if it's still there. Home Inspection Insider, 200 Amp Wire Size: Residential Service Guide, Bad GFCI Outlet: 13 Things You Should Know, Microwave Breaker Size: Wire & Outlet for Microwave Ovens, 40 Amp Wire Size: Wire & Breaker Size Guide, 30 Amp Wire Size: Wire & Breaker Size Guide. zinsco still make 35 amp breakers? . GTE Sylvania Circuit Breakers Type Q, QC, QFP, R38, RC38, & HRGF I am sending you a picture, can you tell if it needs to be replaced? Also is there a place where I can research to find out if my panels were officially recalled? But the design was eventually discontinued, and later Sylvania panels do not have the problematic Zinsco design. Some of these design flaws include: Easy corrosion of the bus bar Here's a couple of recent photos of a Zinsco panel taken by an electrician that I thought were interesting. Zinsco electrical panels were distributed in the United States, primarily in the Western states. REally appreciate your feedback(wow, and quick too!). Maybe try again; type in the Comment box, then click the "Add Image" button to select an image file from your computer or smartphone or tablet. The company was sold in 1973 to GTE- Sylvania, who continued to manufacture breakers and panels to the original Zinsco design for some years; this product line is now discontinued. Ways to Remove a Zinsco Breaker Prepare the Following Tools 1. I am wondering if there is a way to tell if this is a Zinsco brand. SKU:I37023078. US $134. It does day Sylvania and has what I assume is the model number: Touching a live wire or terminal or screw is likely to cause serious electric shock and risks injury or death. Clockwise from upper left: Compare these to other circuit breakers or to other Zinsco breakers in this article series. panel or performs further disassembly (DANGER) can further identify the characteristic circuit breaker details but the circuit breaker Plated aluminum bus bars that get gouged-through when a breaker is inserted (mounting a breaker cuts through the plating and we see corrosion, overheats, failures). But watch out: there are surely plenty of other GTE panels that are a completely different design and don't have the GTE-Sylvania panel issues. The word Zinsco on the panel door tag, on panel labels or data tags (Zinsco panel label photo above). We are changing the panel Monday. 40 A - Light Gray Toggle Handle Part # RC38-40, 50A - Black Toggles, Part # RC38-50 - shown above, 60A - White Toggle or handle, Part # RC38-60 (not shown in the photo above). According to experts, zinsco panels malfunction for two reasons: Design Flaws Electricians have observed that there are indeed design flaws in the Zinsco circuit breaker panels. Ok got pix of the stickers -- will add the images. Hello, The tester also measures voltge drop as a first step, to see if it's safe to do a breaker performance test. Due to the type of aluminum used, Zinsco breakers can melt and fuse to the bus bar, prohibiting the breakers from tripping and can cause house fires. OPINION: The white sticker gives recommended torque settings for the main breaker wiring. I started HomeInspectionInsider.com to help people better understand the home inspection process and answer questions about homeownership and home maintenance. However, they can still be found in older homes and properties built before 1990. CONTACT Us with field reports and photos. The word Magnetrip embossed in the steel electrical panel cover or on data tags in the Zinsco electrical panel. Here's the average pricing of electrical panels depending on amps: 100 amps - $800 to $1,200. So, what breakers are compatible with Zinsco? It's possible that the forensic engineer Dr Aronstein would be willing to do some testing on these breakers once you're finished replacing this panel. Can you assist with that? Excerpts: Use Z I N S C O QFP24 Circuit breaker LK-15, LK-15 or LK-22 for MAINS as indicated. This is accomplished, in brief, by providing a breaker having a switch unit by which shunt current paths of different resistance can be selectively connected in parallel across the current path in which the current is sensed for activating the trip mechanism at a predetermined current level. 225 amps max. Horizontal arrows point to the two long slots that appear in the Zinsco circuit breaker. Below we show the interior of this 400Amp Zinsco electrical panel. What are your thoughts about this panel set-up? Yes your electrical panel is indeed the Zinsco-Sylvania design, that we can see in both labeling and in the unique Zinsco breaker and bus design that shows deep slots into the breaker that slide over vertical edges of the bus bars in the electrical panel. - I want to add a 30 amp breaker to the panel to add a portable generator. I happily agreed and thought it would be a great opportunity to test out my new GoPro 9 in the process. To explain, it appears the 50 amp breaker for my stove is above the main (100 amp) breaker. Here (above and below) we show external and internal identification labels for this 400-Amp Zinsco electrical panel. The Zinsco panels may work for years, but there is an underlying threat as homes have increased energy demands, these panels may overheat and breaker failure can occur. The Zinsco Style may be labeled as Zinsco, Challenger or Sylvaina. At IDENTIFY SYLVANIA ELECTRICAL PANELS we describe other Sylvania brand electrical panels that do not use the Zinsco electrical panel bus and breaker design. There is among electricians an endemic problem common to everyone working in contracting: an unfamiliarity with solid technical research sometimes leads folks to assert that nothing was wrong with product X except that it was the nature of the times in which it was made or installed. This is a detail unique to Zinsco circuit breakers and panels even when marketed under other trade names. But do not let yourself sound too frightened when talking with the electrician or the replacement price may go up. Even if you replace the circuit breakers, the risk from the panel itself will still be present. I think that isfairly common around here. We have published articles on these other panels in part to solicit field reports & research information. Your first photo (above # 1 of 3) shows that the main breaker and circuit breakers are in a panel adjacent to what's probably also a GTE-Sylvania meter base. Brief History of Zinsco Emile Zinsmeyer started Zinsmeyer Co right after the stock market crash of 1929. Zinsco electrical panels were distributed in the United States, primarily in the Western states. Above: Sylvania electrical panel Catalog No. Book your home inspection today by calling 818-298-3405 Back in 2013 over at electriciantalk.com an electrician who was familiar with Unicorn Electrical products commented: The following remarks from a licensed electrician were provided to us courtesy of Al Carson, Carson Dunlop Associates, a Toronto home inspection and home inspection education firm. Here we provide text, labels, and equipment photographs used to help identify Zinsco and GTE-Sylvania-Zinsco electrical panels and circuit breakers, and we include photographs of a Zinsco look alike marketed by Kearney. I discovered it by coincidence doing a search on line during the eight hours they've been here so far. As a result, this made their breakers extremely popular.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'homeinspectioninsider_com-medrectangle-3','ezslot_0',835,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-homeinspectioninsider_com-medrectangle-3-0'); In 1973, Zinsco was sold to GTE Sylvania. Also it was interesting that a New York Electrical Engineer performing independent tests on samples of used circuit breakers of a variety of brands found in very preliminary testing was that there were a few other contemporary panel/breaker products that appeared to have high (compared with overall industry) no-trip rates. 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